Is manufacturing a thing of the past in some parts of the country? Sadly, the imminent closure of Michelin in Dundee is yet another severe blow to heavy industry in the city. Smaller scale manufacturing has always been a factor in Dundee and Angus, as elsewhere, and this post looks at the production of guns, armour, plus timepieces.
For several generations in the 15th century the Moncur (also spelled Muncur) family supplied what must have been exceptionally high quality armour to the top tier of society, including the monarchy. Entries in the Exchequer Rolls of Scotland record repeated payments to the family, over many years. The first entry specifically naming the family appears to be in 1444 (in the reign of James II) and in the following year the entry mentions one Johanni de Moncure, who is also named in the same source ten years later. In 1460, 1466 and 1471 Willelmo de Muncur is the recipient of payment for armour and in 1473 the family's named representative was another John, styled Johanni Muncur.
The entries mentioning this clan of craftsmen continues right to the end of the century and it is apparent that the king then, James IV, esteemed their goods very highly. The following records occur:
A later prominent Dundonian with the name was Alexander Hay Moncur(1830-1905), provost of the burgh from 1880 to 1883. Moncur Crescent in the city is named after him.
According to the Lockit Book of the Hammermen Trade in Dundee, in the year 1587 there were 8 gunmakers in Dundee and 5 sword-slippers. Between that year and 1650 there were 5 active armourers lists, along with 21 gunmakers and 10 sword-slippers. From 1651 to 1750 there were 2 armourers, 5 gunmakers, and 2 sword-slippers, after which these designations cease. The author Fergus Cannan, in Scottish Arms and Armour (2009), states that Dundee pistol manufacturers favours wooden stocks from the early days of the industry and that they later used Brazil wood, since there was a stead imported supply of this, as it was used by other artisans to extract red dye. James Low of Dundee later made guns entirely of brass, again in response to the use of that material in other processes within the burgh.
There appear to be very few identifiable surviving examples of weapons manufactured in Dundee. Local historian A.H. Millar identified on example (published in 'Notice of a Steel Pistol with the Dundee Mark, and of the Armourers of Dundee,' Proceedings of the Society of Antiquaries of Scotland, vol. 22. 1887-7, pp. 276-80. This was an 18th century pistol which was inscribed with the heraldic sign of Dundee, the pots and lilies. This weapon also bears the name of its maker, David M'Kenzie, which allowed Millar to trace its origins.
In the Council Minutes for 18th September 1712, the following entry appears:
The Hammermen Trade was one of the Nine Incorporated Trades of Dundee and its members included armourers, clockmakers and gunsmiths. According the the official website of the guild (found here): 'In the 16th and 17th Century Dundee guns were famous all over Europe and were much sought after. A high proportion of the Trade between 1587 and 1620 were gunmakers with the Ramsay and Alison families featuring prominently.'
The Moncur Family Armourers
For several generations in the 15th century the Moncur (also spelled Muncur) family supplied what must have been exceptionally high quality armour to the top tier of society, including the monarchy. Entries in the Exchequer Rolls of Scotland record repeated payments to the family, over many years. The first entry specifically naming the family appears to be in 1444 (in the reign of James II) and in the following year the entry mentions one Johanni de Moncure, who is also named in the same source ten years later. In 1460, 1466 and 1471 Willelmo de Muncur is the recipient of payment for armour and in 1473 the family's named representative was another John, styled Johanni Muncur.
The entries mentioning this clan of craftsmen continues right to the end of the century and it is apparent that the king then, James IV, esteemed their goods very highly. The following records occur:
1495. - Item, gevin to Muncur of Dundee for leg splentis and a pare of arme splentis.....iiij li.
1496.- Nov. 1st, Item, to a man to ryde to Dundee for to ger mak arm splentis to the King.....ij s.1496. - Nov. 19th, Item, to Moncur of Dundee, for a pare of splentis to the King.....xls.
1497. - Nov. Item to Thome Foret to pass to Dundee to ger mak ane par of splentis to the King.....iis.It would be reasonable to ask where the Moncurs came from and where indeed in Dundee their master foundry and workshop was and what happened to them from the start of the 16th century onward, but most of these things are unknown. It has been surmised that David, Earl of Huntingdon, who promoted Dundee as a burgh in the 12th century, instituted armoury along with many other trades in the town, but there is no definite proof of this.
A later prominent Dundonian with the name was Alexander Hay Moncur(1830-1905), provost of the burgh from 1880 to 1883. Moncur Crescent in the city is named after him.
According to the Lockit Book of the Hammermen Trade in Dundee, in the year 1587 there were 8 gunmakers in Dundee and 5 sword-slippers. Between that year and 1650 there were 5 active armourers lists, along with 21 gunmakers and 10 sword-slippers. From 1651 to 1750 there were 2 armourers, 5 gunmakers, and 2 sword-slippers, after which these designations cease. The author Fergus Cannan, in Scottish Arms and Armour (2009), states that Dundee pistol manufacturers favours wooden stocks from the early days of the industry and that they later used Brazil wood, since there was a stead imported supply of this, as it was used by other artisans to extract red dye. James Low of Dundee later made guns entirely of brass, again in response to the use of that material in other processes within the burgh.
McKenzie, the Gunsmith of Dundee
There appear to be very few identifiable surviving examples of weapons manufactured in Dundee. Local historian A.H. Millar identified on example (published in 'Notice of a Steel Pistol with the Dundee Mark, and of the Armourers of Dundee,' Proceedings of the Society of Antiquaries of Scotland, vol. 22. 1887-7, pp. 276-80. This was an 18th century pistol which was inscribed with the heraldic sign of Dundee, the pots and lilies. This weapon also bears the name of its maker, David M'Kenzie, which allowed Millar to trace its origins.
In the Council Minutes for 18th September 1712, the following entry appears:
The sd day anent ane Petition given in be David M'Kenzie, gunsmith, shewing that where he had payed ffiftie merks for his freedome to the town for his own life, and the Petitioner is content to dress the whole armes belonging to the town for the other half of his burgiship, and therefor craving that the Councill would give him a burgiss tickitt in common forme. Which Petition being considered by the Councill they granted the desire of the sd petition, and appoints the Clerk to give him a burgess tickitt according to the said Act.The record of the gunsmith being admitted as a burgess of the burgh also survives:
HENRIE GUTHRIE, Bailie.
23rd Sep. 1712.—David M'Kenzie, Hammerman, was admitted Burgess andCity records also record David's wife in the year 1725, named Elizabeth Marshall or M'Kenzie. In April of that year she acquired property on the north side of 'the Fleukargait alias Nethergait,' beside the Church of St Mary of Dundee.The couple's daughter was Agnes M'Kenzie, who is noticed in 1743, at which time her father is signified in documents as deceased.
Guild Brother for pay of fyfty merks to John Ballingall, late Treasurer, and
for dressing of the Tounes Armes conforme to ane Act of Council dated 18
Sept, instant.
The Hammermen Trade was one of the Nine Incorporated Trades of Dundee and its members included armourers, clockmakers and gunsmiths. According the the official website of the guild (found here): 'In the 16th and 17th Century Dundee guns were famous all over Europe and were much sought after. A high proportion of the Trade between 1587 and 1620 were gunmakers with the Ramsay and Alison families featuring prominently.'
Dundee's Steeple Clock
Clock-making has had a long history in Dundee, judging from the records. One of the most intriguing, yet shadowy associations with the trade may have been David Ramsay, clockmaker to King James VI. He latterly operated in London and seems to have been a member of the family of that trade who were long active in Dundee. He will be fully considered in a future article.
Dundee's Steeple Clock
The main church in Dundee now has a conspicuous clock in its Old Steeple, but it was not built to house a clock originally. However, the clock was still installed at an early date, at the end of the 14th century. By 1540 it had become so decrepit and unreliable and the town council awarded a contract to the Edinburgh burgess William Purves to provide:
ane sufficient and substantious knok with all instruments of iron work necessary and pertaining thereto, justly ganging, to strike hour and half hour complete and justly, the twenty-four hours day and night, with three warnings to contain six score and ninestraiks (strokes), the first at four hours in the morning, the next at twelve hours at noon, and the third at nine hours at even upon the five bells of the steeple, for the sum of seven score and seventeen pounds, ten shillings; the weight to be four score of stanes or thereby, and gif it happens the knok to weigh ten stone more or less, what she weighs mair to be payed to William, and what she weighs less to be defaulted to him.
The large 'knok' was duly built and installed on Palm Sunday in 1543, but there was a prolonged dispute over the cost. Purves pursued legal action against the Dundee authorities which resulted in him being awarded £197 15s. His clock only lasted for ten years, being destroyed by fire. The next steeple clock was commissioned by another Edinburgh maker, David Kay. The clock was apparently not as good as the previous model and frequently went wrong. The parish clerk, Sir James Kinloch, was given responsibility for the maintenance and upkeep of the clock, and when Sir James died in 1558 his brother William and his young son seems to have been granted the duties which included that they should:
cause the bells to be rung at times convenient and used, until his son be able and qualified to serve in the office. And the treasurer was instructed to deliver to William yearly, to be given to the keeper of the knok, ane stand of claiths.
The Ramsay family (who we will deal with in the future) were responsible for the burgh clock from the 1580s until the middle of the 17th century, at which time there are notices of the clock again, at times, falling into disrepair, under the wardenship of Andrew Tailor.
The Illustrious Ivory Family
In the burgh records of Dundee there is the following entry, dated 22nd September 1767:
Which day James Ivory, watchmaker in Dundee, was admitted burgess for having paid 50 merks Scots to James Dick, sometime treasurer, and having just now paid other 50 merks to Henry Geekie, present acting treasurer, in full of his freedom.
James Ivory quickly gained prominence in Dundee, being adept at his trade and business. He was actually born in Edinburgh in 1729 and worked as an apprentice in London, where he met and married his wife Jane Brown. Towards the end of 1762 he moved to Dundee, and here his son, James, was born. A second son, Thomas, followed his father's trade. James senior was commissioned to craft and install a clock for the steeple of St Andrew's kirk in the Cowgate. It is still in use today. He served as a burgh councillor between the years 1768 and 1789. His eldest son taught in the town's schools and was later knighted, following a successful career as a mathematician. Thomas's son became a respected judge. (Thomas died in 1825 and his father some time before 1795. Sir James Ivory lived from 1765 to 1842)
The timepieces made by James in London are rarest and sold at high value, a testament to his skill and their high quality. Part of this is due, we are told, to his insistence in maintaining the high decorative skill of his profession at a time when others were allowing their products to decline significantly. What prompted him to give up the lucrative trade in London and relocate to Scotland, I do not know.
The Mysterious Mr Cathro
Another thing I do not know is the personal history of Mr Cathro who, in 1823, was amply rewarded by the Admiralty for devising a remarkable chronometer. The following details are from Glasgow Mechanics' Magazine, 1826, vol. ii., page 145:
The large 'knok' was duly built and installed on Palm Sunday in 1543, but there was a prolonged dispute over the cost. Purves pursued legal action against the Dundee authorities which resulted in him being awarded £197 15s. His clock only lasted for ten years, being destroyed by fire. The next steeple clock was commissioned by another Edinburgh maker, David Kay. The clock was apparently not as good as the previous model and frequently went wrong. The parish clerk, Sir James Kinloch, was given responsibility for the maintenance and upkeep of the clock, and when Sir James died in 1558 his brother William and his young son seems to have been granted the duties which included that they should:
cause the bells to be rung at times convenient and used, until his son be able and qualified to serve in the office. And the treasurer was instructed to deliver to William yearly, to be given to the keeper of the knok, ane stand of claiths.
The Ramsay family (who we will deal with in the future) were responsible for the burgh clock from the 1580s until the middle of the 17th century, at which time there are notices of the clock again, at times, falling into disrepair, under the wardenship of Andrew Tailor.
The Illustrious Ivory Family
In the burgh records of Dundee there is the following entry, dated 22nd September 1767:
Which day James Ivory, watchmaker in Dundee, was admitted burgess for having paid 50 merks Scots to James Dick, sometime treasurer, and having just now paid other 50 merks to Henry Geekie, present acting treasurer, in full of his freedom.
James Ivory quickly gained prominence in Dundee, being adept at his trade and business. He was actually born in Edinburgh in 1729 and worked as an apprentice in London, where he met and married his wife Jane Brown. Towards the end of 1762 he moved to Dundee, and here his son, James, was born. A second son, Thomas, followed his father's trade. James senior was commissioned to craft and install a clock for the steeple of St Andrew's kirk in the Cowgate. It is still in use today. He served as a burgh councillor between the years 1768 and 1789. His eldest son taught in the town's schools and was later knighted, following a successful career as a mathematician. Thomas's son became a respected judge. (Thomas died in 1825 and his father some time before 1795. Sir James Ivory lived from 1765 to 1842)
The timepieces made by James in London are rarest and sold at high value, a testament to his skill and their high quality. Part of this is due, we are told, to his insistence in maintaining the high decorative skill of his profession at a time when others were allowing their products to decline significantly. What prompted him to give up the lucrative trade in London and relocate to Scotland, I do not know.
The Mysterious Mr Cathro
Another thing I do not know is the personal history of Mr Cathro who, in 1823, was amply rewarded by the Admiralty for devising a remarkable chronometer. The following details are from Glasgow Mechanics' Magazine, 1826, vol. ii., page 145:
The Lords Commissioners of the Admiralty having advertised a premium of 300 for the best chronometer which should be kept at Greenwich for one year, thirty-six were sent thither by the principal chronometer makers in London and were kept in 1823. It was announced that if any chronometer varied six seconds it could not obtain a prize. At the end of the year the second best chronometer, of which the variation was about five seconds, was made by Mr Cathro, a native of Dundee. Such perfection was never before attained, and it justly excited the astonishment of all astronomers and of the Board of Admiralty.
List of Watch and Clock Makers of Old Angus
Most of the information in the following list is derived from Old Scottish Clockmakers from 1453 to 1850 by John Smith (2nd edition, Edinburgh, 1921). The entries marked * were included in the Dundee Directory, 1853. Further details of Dundonian clockmakers can be found in an article by the Nine Incorporated Trades of Dundee (here).
ADAMSON, CHARLES. High Street, Montrose, 1820-37.
ALISON, JOHN. High Street, Montrose, 1798-1822.
ALSTON, WILLIAM, 7 High Street, Dundee, 1853.*
AUSTEN, JOHN. Dundee, 1836.
BAIN, GEORGE. Upper Wynd, Brechin, 1837.
BALL, THOMAS. Dundee, 1819.
BARCLAY, DAVID. Montrose, about 1830.
BARCLAY, THOMAS. High Street, Montrose, 1811-22.
BATCHELOR, WILLIAM. Dundee, 1816.
BISSET, WILLIAM. Dundee, 1781.
BROWN, GEORGE. West Port, Arbroath, 1834.
CAITHNESS, DAVID. Dundee, 1787.
CAMERON, JAMES. 85 Murraygate, Dundee, 1828-50. (or 88 Murraygate.*)
CARNEGIE,- . Arbroath, 1850.
CONSTABLE, ALEXANDER. Dundee, 1838.
CONSTABLE, WILLIAM. Dundee, 1806.
CONSTABLE, WILLIAM. 7 High Street, Dundee, 1812-28.
CRAW, JAMES. High Street, Forfar, 1837.
CRIGHTON, JOHN. Dundee, 1795.
DAVIDSON, CHARLES. Forfar, 1798-1815.
DICKSON, CHARLES. Dundee, 1722.
DOUGLAS, JAMES. Dundee, 1794.
DRUMMOND, JOHN. Brechin, 1789.
Maker of the new clock in the Town Hall there.
FARQUHARSON, CHARLES. Dundee, 1733-42.
FARQUHARSON, ROBERT. 15 High Street, Dundee,
1847. (Possibly same man as R. W. Farquharson, 1 Castle Street, 1853.*)
FEREN, - . Reform Street, Dundee, 1843.
FERGUSON, ALEXANDER. Dundee, 1777.
FOLEY, WILLIAM, 73 Overgate, Dundee.*
GILRUTH BROTHERS, 52 High St, Dundee.*
GORDON, ALEXANDER. Dundee, 1729.
Maker of the first clock in Brechin Town Hall.
KAY, DAVID. Dundee, 1553-76.
KELT, ALEX, 83 Princes St, Dundee.*
LEIGHTON, WALTER. Montrose, 1830.
LIVINGSTONE, EDWARD. Dundee, 1790.
LOW, THOMAS. 204 Overgate, Dundee, 1828.
LOW, THOMAS, 7 Overgate.*
LOWE, - . Arbroath, 1784.
LUNDIE, JOHN. High Street, Dundee, 1809-37. (Possibly same man, or his son, at 37 High St., Dundee in 1853.*)
MCKENZIE, JOHN, 37 High St., Dundee.*
MANSON, DAVID. Dundee, 1806.
MENZIES, ROBERT. Coupar Angus, 1801.
MICHIE, JAMES. High Street, Brechin, 1837.
MILLER, ALEXANDER. Montrose, 1798; died 26th
September 1808.
MILNE, ROBERT. 50 High Street, Montrose, 1837.
MYLNE, J. A. Montrose, 1740.
NEVAY, WILLIAM. Castle Street, Forfar, 1837.
NICOL, JOSEPH. Coupar Angus, 1801-37.
PETERS, DAVID. 84 High Street, Arbroath, 1837.
RAMSAY, PATRICK, JOHN, AND SILVESTER. Dundee,
1599-1646.
RATTRAY, JAMES, 44 High St., Dundee.*
REED, WILLIAM. Native of Montrose ; died at Whitehaven,
1815.
REID, THOMAS. Montrose, 1788.
RENNIE, ALEXANDER DAVID. 65 High Street, Arbroath,
1837.
RITCHIE, JOHN. Coupar Angus, 1847.
RITCHIE, SAMUEL. Forfar, 1800-37.
ROBB, WILLIAM. Montrose, 1776.
ROBERTSON, CHARLES. Coupar Angus, 1814-37.
ROBERTSON, GEORGE. Dundee, 1806.
ROBERTSON, JAMES. Dundee, 1785.
ROBERTSON, JAMES. High Street, Dundee, 1811-28.
ROSS, CHARLES. Broughty-Ferry, 1828.
ROUGH, DAVID. Hill Town, Dundee, 1820.
SALMON, COLIN. Dundee, 1811.
SCOTT, ANDREW. Dundee, 1776.
SCOTT, DAVID. 73 High Street, Dundee, 1850.(At 69 Wellgate in 1853*).
SCOTT, FREDERICK. 3 Overgate, Dundee, 1837.
SCOTT, WILLIAM. 69 Overgate, Dundee, 1820.
SMALL, THOMAS. Dundee, 1722.
SMITH, ALEXANDER. Dundee, 1718-42.
SMITH, A. P. Reform Street, Dundee, 1850.
SMITH, JAMES. Dundee, 1742.
SMITH, WILLIAM. Dundee, 1668.
SPEED, GEORGE. Dundee, 1749.
STEWART, FRANCIS. High Street, Brechin, 1837.
STRAITON, DAVID. Montrose, 1820-37.
STURROCK, JAMES, 32 Wellgate, Dundee.
WALKER, JAMES. High Street, Montrose, 1820-37.
WALLACE, ROBERT. Forfar, 1798.
WATSON, DAVID. Dundee, 1748.
WEBSTER, THOMAS. Dundee, 1689.
WEHRLE, D, 106 Murraygate, Dundee.*
WHYTOCK, PETER. Overgate, Dundee, 1844. (At 46 High Street and 183 Overgate in 1853.*)
WILD, F. J. Murraygate, Dundee, 1844. (At 36 Union Street in 1853.*)
WILLIAMSON, JAMES. Dundee, 1824.
YOUNG, ARCHIBALD. Murraygate, Dundee, 1828.
YOUNG, J. S. 76 High Street, Dundee.*
YOUNG, JAMES. Wellgate, Dundee, 1828. (Possibly same man at 28 Wellgate in 1853.*)
YOUNG, JOHN G. Murraygate, Dundee, 1850.
YOUNG, PATRICK. Forfar; died 18th January 1811.
YOUNG, THOMAS. Wellgate, Dundee, 1850.
YOUNG, WILLIAM. High Street, Dundee, 1805-43.
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